Sponsor |  TheStrangestGuy | Nov 4, 2004 11:50am | (the title refers to a book by Dostoevsky that all here should read that have not done so)
What I want to understand is related to the kind of man (woman) that will bring to us the ideas of the future, and I don't mean technological ideas, I mean ideas that take us outside out current frame of mind as was done at the beginning of this century by Nietzsche.
Is the man that will define our future a sick introvert that suffers in his own fear and spite (like the Dostoevsky character) and through his suffering comes upon a series of revolutionary ideas? |
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|  Robyn-Moondancer | Nov 4, 2004 5:01pm | I would hope that isnt the case. This is however not one of Dostoevsky's book that I have read. I would rather see someone like Joseph Campbell lead us in to our new awakening. Alas though he has left us. I just know with a certainty it will not likely be me lol.
Love and Light |
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Sponsor | | Blueeyez | Nov 4, 2004 5:44pm | | I thought Ghandi was quite effective along this line as well. No? |
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Sponsor | | TheStrangestGuy | Nov 5, 2004 7:01pm | | I think Ghandi wasn't very impressive. At least I believe so. It is much easier to be nonviolent when you have no real power. However, when one has POWER, it seems that they cannot use it for peace. Like Goerthe said: "For world peace, the most powerful military nation has to give up all it's machinery of war, and leave itself open for distruction." That is the way (though it seems impossible). Ghandi is inspiring but too contrary to human nature. |
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| | | Belial | Nov 5, 2004 11:38pm | "
Is the man that will define our future a sick introvert that suffers in his own fear and spite (like the Dostoevsky character) and through his suffering comes upon a series of revolutionary ideas?"
Yes. |
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Sponsor | | Dudymas | Nov 7, 2004 8:14pm | | 2: Why hope not? It's not like those people are a minority... I'd assume a lot of people learn through suffering that they themselves cause. I think a perfectly normal person might be heard out... that ultimately humanity will uncover its destiny through itself as a whole(sound humanistic perhaps... but I'm not that much of a humanist). |
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Sponsor | | TheStrangestGuy | Nov 12, 2004 11:01am | The point is that those that are brave enough to realize their meaninglessness are the ones that really suffer.
Despite the widespread exclamations about the meaninglessness of life, I would venture to suggest that the kind of people that genuinely are coping with the implications of the fact that THEY ARE GOING TO DIE are actually rare. Those are the people that I was speaking of. The people that are outside not only society but also their socially created ego's. |
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Sponsor | | OrionBlastar | Nov 12, 2004 12:29pm | 7: Which are the ones to worry about, for they may have a lifetime of misery worrying about that they are going to die, and not taking the time to enjoy life or exist in society. They may go from job to job, not being able to fit in. In order to hold a job, requires one to join the society there, those that do not fit into that society are treated badly and forced to quit or fired. Then this negative event creates even more negativity in their life, they think "I can't hold a job, I won't be able to take care of myself and my family, I am going to die." They may actually get suicidal and blame themselves for losing their job and not being able to hold a job. They may reason that if they are going to die anyway, might as well make it sooner than later and end their suffering. They will continue to exclaim that their life is meaningless, and get more and more depressed. Not having a social network to fall back on, they have little to no support. Few friends, a small circle of family members (those that didn't give up on them yet), and whatever they can get (Be it the Internet, a hotline, social worker, stranger, etc) to try and cry for help (the fear of death now battles with their fear of living), society generally rejects suicidal people and claim they are trying to get attention so there is more rejection here, more abuse, and they are told to go away. Some mean people may even tell them to go ahead and kill themselves and stop whining about it. This fuels their fear ogf living and they feel their lives are even more meaningless, and that they are going to die real soon now. Hopelessly rejected by society, this person does what they can to surive maybe for one more day, or they may actually lose the battle for living and try to end it.
Been there, done that, survived it so far. |
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Sponsor | | trebenaid | Nov 12, 2004 3:22pm | | It's time to find a NEW hobby now OB |
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| | | catch | Nov 12, 2004 4:17pm | What if stumbling is his new hobby?
"The point is that those that are brave enough to realize their meaninglessness are the ones that really suffer."
Time to start an existentialism thread...
Are we brave to realize meaninglessness? Or is meaninlessness something that hits us in the head like a sack of rocks?
I have long believed that Victor Frankl understood the core of the question when he said that work, play and love are the paths to meaning. The bravery, if there is any, is in creating all three of these in a balance so that meaning comes about on its own.
I would add that those who are lucky enough to be lifted up by their spiritual beliefs have a direct line to meaning. We have hard wiring in our brains to talk to God (the brain's g-spot). Does the wiring exist as a portal to God? Or does it exist as a result of natural selection (the atheists and agnostics were burned at various stakes and didn't stick around to pro-create).
God's existence is irrelevant, the wiring exists. For someone like me, it's an appendix, a spleen, it doesn't do me any good. For me, even atheism is too much of a leap of faith. But for those who can give their problems to God? Ah, they have meaning. |
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